Welcome to the Gundam Forums.
Page 88 of 88 FirstFirst ... 3878838485868788
Results 1,306 to 1,314 of 1314
  1. #1306
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Deep Blue sea.
    Posts
    672

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    Quote Originally Posted by Riah View Post
    So I know almost nothing about CE tech, so can somebody explain to me why and how a garbage man has his gundam wielding a 150 meter katana? So like is Astray just G Gundam set in CE?
    Rule of cool?
    Getting back into Gunpla, slowly.

    Resident Efreet and resident shark person.

  2. #1307
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    The California Base
    Posts
    7,074

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    Quote Originally Posted by RileyWarfield View Post
    Rule of cool?
    Exactly.
    "You see, there's no need to wonder where your god is. Because he's right here! And he's fresh out of mercy!"
    -Kirito (SAO Abridged)

    "Well, what good is being a god if you can't smite some people?"
    - Epsilon Church

  3. #1308
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    The Dutchy of John
    Posts
    1,874

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    So why/how do the F91 versions of the Jegans have literally two to three times the acceleration of their CCA counterarts? For reference, going by the likes of their thrust power, they seem to be equal or better to the Sinaju in performance. Normally I'd think that it's newer tech just added on to the cheap to produce Jegan frame, but Gundam Unicorn has a D-Type Jegan, which would mean the A-Type and B-Types already existed at that time. The A and B and Normal Type were still ancient at the time of F91 and not modern machines. This also means that at the time of fighting The Sleeves, the Federation had mass producable super Jegans that each could take on the Sinaju singlehandedly, but they only decided to use them decades later because reasons. But the D-Type is somehow WEAKER than what it succeeded, though that's actually normal considering that the GM III is far faster than the original Jegan.
    Last edited by Riah; December 13, 2016 at 5:20 AM.
    Ways to reach me if the site really does go down:
    Discord: BadWrongFun#0889
    Email: badwrongfun@gmx.com
    Mastodon:https://glitch.social/web/accounts/41917
    Twitter: @bad_wrong_fun


  4. #1309
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    The Internet
    Posts
    574

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    Basically, because the A, B, C and Normal came after the D.

    If Unicorn had been made in the 90s they would be in correct order, but since the writers for Gundam F91 already made A, B, C, and Normal types, Unicorn had to go with D because there can't be two A model Jegans.

    Plus, I still question if the F91 era Jegans could handle the Sinanju. Thrust alone doesn't win MS fights, and the Sinanju still has the advantage in firepower, reaction time (psychoframes and stuff), armor, and most importantly, an ace pilot.


    Go Jegan or go home.



  5. #1310
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    The California Base
    Posts
    7,074

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    This thread needs a jump start to it's heart, literally. Without further ado, I present to you Minovsky Man's video on mobile suit controls. Side note: this video is best viewed either on your smart phone (who doesn't have one?) or through a VR headset.

    "You see, there's no need to wonder where your god is. Because he's right here! And he's fresh out of mercy!"
    -Kirito (SAO Abridged)

    "Well, what good is being a god if you can't smite some people?"
    - Epsilon Church

  6. #1311
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    291

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    I have almost certainly mentioned this before, I will again just because....

    I like the idea of the Titans, but the idea of them using Zeon mobile suits is just plain ridiculous.

    Zeon lost the war, and lost the war by a pretty significant margin. Literally anywhere in that war that any Feddie suit that could in anyway be called a "Gundam" showed up, Zeon had not a single victory and their troops became as equally effective as if they just stood there and shot themselves in the head. They accomplished absolutely nothing the very second any Feddie mobile suit showed up and every single last Zeon mobile suit that hit the field was destroyed the second it encountered one made by Anaheim Electronics.

    The idea that after the war the elite of the elite of the Earth Federation forces would then go and use the utterly worthless and completely ineffective Zeonic mobile suits instead of continuing to field "Gundam"-- a single one of which would far more suit their purpose of striking fear in the Space Colonists given that, again-- not a single "Gundam" was ever shot down, ever defeated, ever even significantly damaged to anyone's knowledge by even the most powerful and elite Mobile Armors and specialty Mobile Suits that only a New Type could possible control-- is the height of absolute stupidity. Perhaps the largest plothole in the entire series. The "Gundam" of any shape and sort had already earned the reputation of complete invincibility and no upstart space colonist faction would ever even think of starting shit knowing that they would be faced one.

    Instead-- this "racist" group of anti-Spacers decided to make their mainline suit.... a Zaku. The most utterly worthless, ineffectual, piece of crap mobile suit ever to be fielded. The suit that most of those who climbed inside died within their first minute of operation. At least after the point in the war in which the Earth Federation was fielding any action mobile suits.

    Even if one could possibly argue that the "High Zaku" in any way, shape or form could out-perform a Gundam Mass-Production Type in any sort of test, and even that isn't particularly clear, the fact that the Titans doing their job was highly reliant on reputation alone and they chose to go out there in suits that had the reputation of being mooks instead of those with the reputation of being invincible just doesn't work.

    And if that alone wasn't bad enough-- the fact that they kept producing them in the green color scheme associated with Zeon despite the fact that they were apparently the people who were so angry and hateful towards Zeon that they became even more fanatical and dangerous than Zeon ever was... it just doesn't work, it fundamentally undermines and destroys the theme of the whole series.

    The insistence that the good guys MUST be piloting white Gundams and the bad guys MUST be piloting green or red Zakus and nothing must ever deviate from that utterly destroyed the entire concept of the follow-up series. In fact, even within video games until the 2010s there wasn't a single game that recognized that the Titans were meant to be Earth Feddie baddies rather than just another faction of Zeon. Instead, all games treated them as an extension of Zeon-- meaning even Bandai didn't grasp even that basic concept of the series until nearly 30 years after the series came out.

    Which is probably why UC Gundam is forced into the infinite loop of "Zeon Remnants vs. Earth Federation" despite that battle always turning out exactly the same way every time and each time it becomes increasingly more ridiculous that there could possibly be any remnants of Zeon left or that what is left could remotely pose a threat.
    [RP]Mobile Suit Gundam: War-Torn Horizons - Nobuyori Takeda, pilot of Elmeda (Tokugawa Knight Custom)

  7. #1312
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    In yer base killin yer GMs
    Posts
    9,178

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    Well for one fuck yourself, and two Zakus did very well especially considering their age and how undermanned Zeon was. The focus was usually on the gundams and making them look good to sell toys. And Zeon's defeat did not come easily. Many units held their own believing the surrender to be just feddie propaganda (midnight fenrir) and gundams were defeated when the plot and story allowed. (The GP-01, GP-03 and RX -79G ) but nothing you can do to get through plot armor aside from having it yourself.

    And once Anaheim snapped up all the Zeon engineers no one could make anything better. And after the United maintenance plan went into effect making improvements to any mainline MS was just shy of impossible because you either had to use standardized parts or the MS you are making will be a one off or just impossible to get parts for in the field.

    Also nothing is consistent when it comes to the performance of mobile suits. The numbers are all made up and go back and forth as bandai/sunrise tried to drive sales in a particular direction or move the plot a certain way or to make a scene cooler or whatever.

    But i do agree with your general point here. It would have made more sense if the titans were using GMs (they should have plenty still and they made newer ones) Its just what you are saying that they HAD to have the "bad guys" in zeonic looking MS and the good guys in feddie looking MS. and they even state that after the war zeon soldiers joined the titans is bull. Even if theu were individuals who didnt care anout Zeon and just fought for Zeon in the OYW to make a name for themselves the federation would never trust them and i highly doubt they would want to go hunt down and kill Zeons side by side with people who were trying to kill them not long ago. And according to the gundam wiki (witch is mostly just fan speculation i admit) the Hi-zack was made by anaheim and their excuse for it looking like a Zaku is because Anaheim snapped up Zeonic corporation after the war. Thats a really dumb reason honestly they would have made them make suits that look like feddie suits and personally i would refuce so make the federation anything in the zeonic style. And id sabotage their shit as well.

    Also this is not what i had in mind for this thread. Because this is a writing issue not a technical issue.

    Zeon remnants are absolutely a valid threat. With the way the federation treats spacenoids its easy to recruit and with how lazy and incompetent they are its not that hard to steal their gear and emply gurilla tactics against them.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeta View Post
    This thread needs a jump start to it's heart, literally. Without further ado, I present to you Minovsky Man's video on mobile suit controls. Side note: this video is best viewed either on your smart phone (who doesn't have one?) or through a VR headset.

    Thats really neat. But idk about those controls. Thats better than what i can come up with as far as explaining tue controls in tue show but a direct nervous system connection would still be better imo.

    - - - Updated - - -

    One of these days ill find a good replacement for photobucket. When they decided to rake us over the coals is about when i fell off

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also read the wiki entry for the Hi-Zack. Its basically "it looks like a zaku so its sucks" fuck whoever wrote it. You telling me a MS made by Anaheim long after the war cant use a beam saber and beam rifle at the same time?

    Zaku on kova luu.
    YOU WANT TO BE MORE THAN JUST A GRUNT? LEARN TO SEE THE BIG PICTURE!
    In the absence of orders, go find something and kill it. -Erwin Rommel
    They're on our right, they're on our left. They're in front of us, they're behind us; they cant get away from us this time -chesty puller
    http://www.gundamforums.com/showthre...3-Zaku-s-WIP-s

  8. #1313
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    11,831

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    [/QUOTE=Zaku;296251]Well for one fuck yourself, and two Zakus did very well especially considering their age and how undermanned Zeon was. The focus was usually on the gundams and making them look good to sell toys. And Zeon's defeat did not come easily. Many units held their own believing the surrender to be just feddie propaganda (midnight fenrir) and gundams were defeated when the plot and story allowed. (The GP-01, GP-03 and RX -79G ) but nothing you can do to get through plot armor aside from having it yourself. [/QUOTE=]
    Well, Zaku was very much a gen 1.5 (if we are using jet fighter inspired terminology, Zaku 1 is a gen 1, Zaku II is a gen 1.5, Gundam is a gen two, Zeta Gen 3, borderline gen 4. Unicorn Gen 6 etc), Zakus, when not fighting main characters, have been worthy adversaries(insert screeching feds here). As a whole Zeon suits have maintained battlefield relevance longer than their feddie counterparts (though this can be contributed to the difference in pilot experience as well). But as mentioned, main character shield

    [/QUOTE=]And once Anaheim snapped up all the Zeon engineers no one could make anything better. And after the United maintenance plan went into effect making improvements to any mainline MS was just shy of impossible because you either had to use standardized parts or the MS you are making will be a one off or just impossible to get parts for in the field.
    I like to think that Federation napped the Zeonic engineers mostly to prevent them from falling into whomever could oppose them (Axis, Delaz), and not as much for their immediate knowledge (Feddies had managed to leap ahead of Zeon in mass production and standardization of their MSes and of course portable beam weapons.)
    Also nothing is consistent when it comes to the performance of mobile suits. The numbers are all made up and go back and forth as bandai/sunrise tried to drive sales in a particular direction or move the plot a certain way or to make a scene cooler or whatever. [/QUOTE=]
    Also this, I think the lore fluff writers didn't quite think through how much energy fusion reactors possibly could output.

    [/QUOTE=]But i do agree with your general point here. It would have made more sense if the titans were using GMs (they should have plenty still and they made newer ones) Its just what you are saying that they HAD to have the "bad guys" in zeonic looking MS and the good guys in feddie looking MS. and they even state that after the war zeon soldiers joined the titans is bull. Even if theu were individuals who didnt care anout Zeon and just fought for Zeon in the OYW to make a name for themselves the federation would never trust them and i highly doubt they would want to go hunt down and kill Zeons side by side with people who were trying to kill them not long ago. And according to the gundam wiki (witch is mostly just fan speculation i admit) the Hi-zack was made by anaheim and their excuse for it looking like a Zaku is because Anaheim snapped up Zeonic corporation after the war. Thats a really dumb reason honestly they would have made them make suits that look like feddie suits and personally i would refuce so make the federation anything in the zeonic style. And id sabotage their shit as well. [/QUOTE=]
    In Advance of Zeta, the GM Quel and GM Kai are main stays in Teehtans arsenal, all the Hazels are pretty much Quels with Gundam heads, but I think the real reason why Titans had monoeys suits is to keep the "Monoeye bad, visor good" thing going, even though GM's and Gundams should have been they main stay. AEUG should have Hodge bodge mix of both fed and zeek suits and ships in their arsenal, instead of being almost entirely fed.

    On Zeon troops joining Titans, would not be out of the realm of possibility. Career soldiers and less ideologue troopers would take on the chance to serve the Federation especially if they could receive a pardon for their actions (see Nazies whom served in Bunderswehr and NVA) and considering Zeon was hardly unified, so those opposed of more hard line leaders like Gihren could possibly use Federation to fight their rivals. This is conjecture of course but soldiers switching sides especially if their leaders are unpopular is quite common.


    [/QUOTE=] remnants are absolutely a valid threat. With the way the federation treats spacenoids its easy to recruit and with how lazy and incompetent they are its not that hard to steal their gear and employ guerilla tactics against them.[/QUOTE=]

    Even when the Zeon government fell, quite a lot of Zeon troops remained in the field, so the chance of number of them continuing the fight is a real threat. Also several rebellions and insurgencies have continued on for decades( Though the real reason again is because Zeon is popular and GUARANTEED to bring in the money.

    [QUOTE]Also read the wiki entry for the Hi-Zack. Its basically "it looks like a zaku so its sucks" fuck whoever wrote it. You telling me a MS made by Anaheim long after the war cant use a beam saber and beam rifle at the same time?[/QUOTE=]
    With this, think the Hi Zack was built to a standard and the Anaheim cheaped out with generators, providing enough power for thrust but lacking for weaponry ( or it's lazy writing.)



    - - - Updated - - -

    I also suck d**** and can't quote properly.




  9. #1314
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    In yer base killin yer GMs
    Posts
    9,178

    Re: Mobile suit theory and development.

    Even mobile suit lineage depends on what you do and dont consider cannon and what kind of mood bandai/sunrise are in.

    And Zonic engineers would have been higly sought after especially with how much work Zeon put into psycho technology and newtype research in the war. But i think not letting another facfion get them is an equally important reason. Most likely both are true tbh.

    And ive still not gotten around to reading AOZ. Idk why. But i agree the titans should have been using gundams and GMs and been totally against using anything that looked remotly Zeonic. And the AEUG should have been using mostly Zeon MS with some stolen GMs and the MK-IIs and such. Just like a newer faction would. Use whatever you can get your hands on and whatever works.

    And i dont mean its unreasonable for ANY Zeon soldiers to habe joined the titans just not many. I would have done anything to kill Gihren early in the war. I hate to say it but Kycilia was the best leader. Dozle was a good man but not as cunning or knowledgeable. Garma was just out for his pride and just to immature. And as much as i hate Gihren i respected and really liked Dozle and respected and could have worked with Kycilia.

    Yea ill admit the number of how many Zeon troops remained afield was probably just to crank out more manga cause money but it does make sense. If you cannot communicate with your main forces then the enemy telling you "your govt surrendered, give up your weapons and come let us torture you" is gonna sound like BS.

    And id go with lazy writing. No way anaheim could cheap out so hard on a MS made in UC 0084 that cant use any beam rifle and beam saber at the same time. Unless that wiki article was written by someone who was just guessing (more likely). The show is unreliable, the wiki is unreliable and bandai/sunrise just tells you what you want to hear or what will drum up sales. If gundam were real these facts, dates and figures would be set in stone. At least significantly more so. But retconning, shows being inconsistent af and what is and isnt cannon changing forces us to speculate.

    Zaku on kova luu.
    YOU WANT TO BE MORE THAN JUST A GRUNT? LEARN TO SEE THE BIG PICTURE!
    In the absence of orders, go find something and kill it. -Erwin Rommel
    They're on our right, they're on our left. They're in front of us, they're behind us; they cant get away from us this time -chesty puller
    http://www.gundamforums.com/showthre...3-Zaku-s-WIP-s


 

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •